'Judiciary Has Not Exactly Covered Itself In Glory When It Comes To Complaints By Women' : Sr Adv Rebecca M. John

"Judiciary has not exactly covered itself in glory when it comes to (sexual harassment)complaints by women. And particularly when they are accusing men in high positions. Most of the women complainants have had no redressal from the legal system", said Rebecca M. John, Senior Advocate, in an interview with Live Law. The senior lawyer expressed astonishment at the reports that some judges had voiced apprehensions about engaging women staff in the wake of sexual harassment allegations against the Chief Justice of India. She stressed the need for more gender balance and level playing field for women in the system"Pushing women out of the workplace is not the answer. The answer is addressing the root cause of the problem and the root-cause of the problem appears to be a great sexual imbalance in the system. By pushing them out you are only perpetrating that sexual imbalance", she said.She also criticized the trend of branding those who question the system as "institutional disrupters"."We question the system to strengthen the system and not to undermine it in any way...We raise questions because we value our institutions. To say that when I am raising a challenge I become a disrupter is an insult to the institution and to me as a member of the institution", said the senior criminal lawyer who has handled notable cases such as Arushi Talwar, Hashimpura, 2G trial etc. Based on her experiences as an external member of the Internal Complaints Committee set up by the Delhi High Court, she elaborated on the need to review the Prevention of Sexual Harassment at Workplace Act to include relationships which fall outside the traditional employer-employee framework.Referring to the "me too" movement, she said the fact that women had to take to social media in search for closure and justice indicated a failure of legal systems across the world."I think the fact that social media was used not just in India but across the world is a testament to the fact that legal systems across the world have failed women and the institutions set up to protect women have not really done their job", she commented.Excerpts from the interview:Do you think that the judicial system and legal profession have normalized and internalized sexism and misogyny?That's very true. It is very clear. Sometimes you see an onslaught of it, sometimes you think it gets better. But the fact is that there is sexism in the judicial system. It has always existed, in many ways; and it is worse now.You are saying that sexism in judicial system has become worse now. How is it so?Well in the earlier days there were not so many women who were practicing. It was a male domain. Today, when woman are pushing the limits inside the legal system and court rooms, I think sexism is one backlash they face.After the sexual harassment allegations against the CJI, there were reports that judges have expressed apprehensions about employing women staff and engaging women law clerks. What is your response to this?I am a little amazed that something like this could be said. I don't know whether this has actually been said or if it is only a report without any basis. But if it is indeed an apprehension that has been expressed, I can only remind the judges that under the Indian Constitution, women are entitled to equality. Women are entitled to equal, fair, level playing field when it comes to their workplace.Pushing women out of the workplace is not the answer. The answer is addressing the root cause of the problem and the root-cause of the problem appears to be the great sexual imbalance in the system. By pushing them out you are only perpetrating that sexual imbalance.I have in fact heard of many law chambers, including some very reputed law chambers, where women are not welcome as juniors or associates... and I am increasingly hearing that now. That again is a sad thing. Because as lawyers we too are bound to uphold the Constitution and if our own law chambers do exclude women, then it is unfortunate."Pushing women out of the workplace is not the answer. The answer is addressing the root cause of the problem and the root-cause of the problem appears to be the great sexual imbalance in the system. By pushing them out you are only perpetrating that sexual imbalance". You are a member of Internal Complaints Committee of the Delhi High Court formed under the POSH Act. Can you share some experiences as a part of ICC?What I can say is, we have tried to create an environment which is sensitive and we have succeeded in helping women who have come forward as complainants; at least to allow them to feel comfortable. We have dealt with some very very sensitive cases in the past. From my experiences regarding the working of the Act, I think that there are many aspects of it which require reconsideration. What is the writ of the ICC, when it comes to relationships which is outside employer-employee relationships? We are already noticing some flaws in the regulations drafted by the Supreme...

'Judiciary Has Not Exactly Covered Itself In Glory When It Comes To Complaints By Women' : Sr Adv Rebecca M. John

Manu Sebastian

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